EBB 379 – A Challenging Birth Story with GBS, Prolonged PROM, Pitocin, and an Epidural, with EBB Childbirth Class Graduate Erica Wright and EBB Instructor Tara Thompson

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:00:00:

Hi, everyone. We have an inspiring birth story for you to listen to today. Before we dive in, you may have heard that the Evidence Based Birth® “My Doula Visit” workbook launched this week. If you still want to grab a copy or get a bulk order in you can shop the workbooks through Monday, December 2. During the sale you can order your workbooks at the introductory price of just twenty-nine dollars each, and there are bulk order discounts available. The “My Doula Visit” workbook is an amazing color printed, spiral bound workbook. It’s 115 pages long and gives you a tangible way to help families build their birth team, do birth planning, practice comfort measures, and learn about advocacy, inductions, Cesareans, and postpartum planning. And we’ve integrated 18 of the best EBB handouts into the suggested prenatal visit curriculum and it’s all there in the workbook for you. If you want to start using these workbooks with your clients in 2026 don’t wait. Go ahead and place your order today. To get your workbook just go to EBBirth.com/shop. I can’t wait to see doulas bringing some of the best EBB resources to their prenatal visits. 

And now, on today’s podcast let’s talk with EBB Childbirth Class graduate Erica Wright and her EBB Instructor and one of her doulas Tara Thompson about navigating a challenging birth experience with a powerful support team. 

Welcome to the Evidence Based Birth® Podcast. My name is Rebecca Dekker, and I’m a nurse with my PhD and the founder of Evidence Based Birth®. Join me each week as we work together to get evidence-based information into the hands of families and professionals around the world. As a reminder, this information is not medical advice. See ebbirth.com/disclaimer for more details. 

Hi, everyone, and welcome to today’s episode of the Evidence Based Birth® Podcast. Today, I am so excited to have two guests on the podcast, a parent and her doula. So Erica Wright is an elementary educator who has taught in public education for 11 years in the metro Atlanta area. She has a Bachelor of Science and a master’s degree in early childhood education. And Erica is now an instructional coach at her elementary school part-time, enabling to be home with her daughter more. And Erica is a graduate of the EBB Childbirth Class, with Instructor Tara Thompson. Tara is a New York native and moved to Georgia with her family in 2005. Ever since, she has been fully dedicated to serving prenatal and postpartum families. Tara is a certified birth doula, a prenatal and postpartum massage therapist, a certified body-ready method pro, and an Evidence Based Birth®  Instructor who teaches the EBB Childbirth Class. Erica and Tara, welcome to both of you to the Evidence Based Birth® Podcast.

Erica Wright – 00:01:53:

Hi, thank you. It’s an honor to be here. It’s an honor to meet you.

Tara Thompson – 00:01:56:

Hi, thank you so much. It’s good seeing you again, both of you.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:02:00:

Tara, I also wanted to mention is a repeat guest. So Tara, you were on episode 146 of the Evidence Based Birth® Podcast. We’ll make sure to put that in the show notes. And it’s unique. We have not had often. I think we’ve only maybe one or two times before had both a parent and their doula on the podcast because I think you get like a unique perspective to hear the story from both people’s point of view. And Erica, I was wondering if you could start us off by telling us like how you found Tara, how you learned about Evidence Based Birth®.

Erica Wright – 00:02:32:

Yeah. So I kind of have to give a shout out to my friend Azaria. She was one of the only people in my close circle. We have always been very aligned in like really believing in low medical intervention kind of like all through she’s my friend from college, like all through college and after. So when she got pregnant and had her baby, she was the only person in my circle I knew that had a home birth. And I got pregnant shortly after her. And after hearing her home birth story, I was just like, I had always kind of known that I wanted a natural birth, low medical intervention kind of thing. And after hearing her story, like just knowing that that was possible. And she was the one that mentioned, you know, I was asking her for all the advice. And she said, of course, a doula and a midwives and is the one that told me about Evidence Based Birth®. And so I started listening to the podcast and just like soaking in as much information as I could from the podcast. 

And then throughout some of my very early on prenatal appointments, mentioned to my midwives that I wanted a natural labor and a natural birth and kind of just some of those preferences that I already kind of knew that I wanted. The midwife said, yeah, I definitely recommend a doula. And she actually was the one that mentioned Tara and Brittany’s doula services that they work for. So that’s kind of how I found them. And then I actually, after hearing Tara say that she’s an Evidence Based Birth® educator also, that was a big like, oh, well, I was planning on taking the Childbirth Class anyway. Like that would be so nice to take it from my doula. So that was like an awesome two and one thing. And then she mentioned she was on an episode that you kind of mentioned just now. And I went and listened to it. And that’s kind of how I knew. I was like, oh, yeah, she’s my girl. It kind of even in like our interview with her, it was like she reminds me a lot of my friend Azari that I was like just mentioning. So it felt like I had known Tara for a long time. And she’s like you said, prenatal massage therapist, which I used her services when I was 41 weeks plus to like get the ball rolling. And they actually are a doula team. So Brittany is another name that you’ll probably hear throughout the birth story. That was her partner during my birth. They did. They switched off on like 12 hour shifts, which was another thing that I liked to keep them to keep them fresh because it was a long it was a long road.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:04:55:

And Tara, you’ve been doing a lot of work in Atlanta, and it’s been like more than 200 episodes since we interviewed. So give us a little update or a brief summary of what you’re doing in Atlanta for our listeners who aren’t familiar with your work.

Tara Thompson – 00:05:09:

Yes. So excited to be back. Thank you so much for having me. Yes. So I believe that was. Oh, wow. Like maybe in the pandemic when we recorded that episode. And I think I was just transitioning. I may have still been there or just transitioning from, you know, one of the major hospitals here where I was teaching and then went full on with EBB just because, you know, I love it so much and I love the program and how you stay up to date and research with everything, you know, and I explain that with my interviews with my couples, just so they see the difference because, you know, a lot of them like, oh, well, should I take this or should I take that? Because all of our doula clients, we recommend that they take a Childbirth Class and we don’t force them on which class. We give them the information. But when I explain the difference, then they’re like, okay, yes, I think we want the EBB class. So like Erica, you know, just we didn’t force her, you know, we do recommend or we do require them to take an education class because even with our doula clients, you know, we’re your doula, we’re there to help you advocate for you and inform you, but we can’t do it all for you. So we want to make sure, you know, during your prenatal appointments, you’re informed, you’re educated, and you have, you know, you know, your choices. You know, that’s what I’ve been doing here. And I’ve since gone on to be a breastfeeding counselor as well. And on the road to and on the path to become an IBCLC next. So that’s my next journey, but still loving EBB and still planning to teach this for a long, long time.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:06:36:

Yes, you’ve been with EBB for a long time. And I do remember it was a, it was, you know, not easy to transition from working for hospital to, you know, owning your own business and finding your own clients. And you’ve really become a powerhouse in the Atlanta area. And kind of like Erica said too – having a doula that’s a massage therapist. I mean, that’s that’s pretty amazing. So we’re so excited to have you back on the podcast, Tara. When you first met Erica, this was I know this was over a year ago. What did you notice about her goals and mindset for birth and how she was putting together her support team?

Tara Thompson – 00:07:12:

I noticed for one, again, like she mentioned, you know, the things with our interview, the things that she was saying, you know, as far as wanting a natural birth and wanting less interventions and doing it on her own. So I did notice that definitely aligned with EBB, you know, having that information and knowing going in, like I said, with the prenatal appointments, as well as when you’re in the hospital, you know, and finding a midwife. And she knew, you know, she wanted a midwife as opposed to an OB and things she was already educated on was very helpful because that, you know, helps with along the process with them, with their prenatal vision. It’s not like we met, you know, as soon as she found out she conceived that she was like, oh, okay, well, let me just get all information. She’d be, she, she came educated. She, you know, joined on and she was already educated with a lot of information.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:08:03:

So Erica, you already had been kind of learning from the podcast and other resources. So when you took the class with Tara, what are some of your memories or things that you learned that stood out for you?

Erica Wright – 00:08:17:

Probably the cascade of interventions was kind of probably a big, like, light bulb moment for me, which always made sense. Like I said, I have never been like a big medical person. I’ve always just kind of avoided unless like absolutely necessary, any type of like medical intervention. So the, we were like speaking the same language, the stuff that I was learning, I was like, oh, that makes sense. And just the, the evidence behind things and like things that I’ve heard, even from like, not only like my parents’ generation, but like women in my generation and their birth stories, like very recently of like, oh, this happened, you know, when I had my son, my daughter, things that happened in their birth story that I’m like, wait, okay, but I just learned about this in my class. And I know that’s like maybe considered like standard practice, but the evidence says, and I’m like getting on my soapbox around all my like pregnant friends about actually the evidence says like X, Y, Z about this and there are risks and the benefits and the, how to like advocate for yourself. And I think another thing that probably would have done me well to keep more front of mind was the, um, the pain, Tara helped me the pain, fear, the cycle.

Tara Thompson – 00:09:31:

Oh, pain control, the gate control theory.

Erica Wright – 00:09:36:

Yeah, yeah.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:09:37:

The pain, the anxiety cycle as well. Yeah.

Erica Wright – 00:09:43:

Yeah. I think that was a big, one of the pitfalls, one of my downfalls for sure. Once we got to the hospital, I think that really, I couldn’t really let go of that. So I think that affected me too. But just having the knowledge and the vernacular, the verbiage to be able to explain that and advocate for myself.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:10:06:

Okay, so you were planning a hospital birth with a midwife. A doula team. And anything else special you were hoping to have? You mentioned unmedicated birth. Did the hospital where you were giving birth, did it have a reputation for being able to support unmedicated birth?

Erica Wright – 00:10:22:

So actually, I switched practices. I’m sure Tara remembers well. The practice that I was originally at, well, pre-pregnancy, I was at a practice with just OBs. Found out I was pregnant, switched practices to a practice that had midwives. They had about nine midwives. I was like, great, I’ll go to all the locations. I’ll go to it so I can meet all of them. So by the time, whatever. But their hospital that they exclusively deliver at, it’s known as the baby factory in Atlanta. So it does not really have a great reputation for supporting natural unmedicated births. So that was kind of, but I thought, as long as I advocate for myself and I have my birth plan and I have my doulas, I can make this happen. And just the more I heard from a couple of the midwives that I had prenatal appointments with about standard practice and policies and how long they were even willing to let me go pregnant. It was kind of a hard stop at 41 weeks, along with like even delivery positions that they were kind of, we preferred to, for you to deliver on the bed. Cause if you’re on the floor, then we have to be on the floor type of thing. 

So just kind of like red flags that I was getting from, from them and Tara and Brittany helped me, um, kind of, they kind of were like, listen to your gut. Like there, there are other options. And so it kind of took me a while to eventually be like, okay, I’m not like. It’s not too late to switch practices, basically. So around 30 weeks, I started the process of looking at other practices in the area that have midwives but deliver at hospitals that are maybe more supportive of unmedicated labors. And I actually, my husband and I, this is like around 30, 32 weeks, we wrote up a list of questions to ask at this meet and greet, this midwife at a new practice. It was a list of 40 questions. The list of 40 questions heard around the world. She brought that up a couple more times after we switched. But I just wanted to be sure that I was switching for a better outcome. She passed the test. So I actually went back into my calendar and looked. My first real prenatal appointment with them was at 35 weeks at this new practice. So that was, I asked my husband, I was like, when do you think we? He was like, oh, probably like 27. I was like, it was like 35 weeks. So it was pretty late, but still enough time I felt like. I mean, that was probably the best decision that I made to switch practices and switch hospitals. So the hospital that we switched to is, correct me if I’m wrong, Tara, I think it’s the only hospital in the state that allows water births. Which is something that I was like looking into also.

Tara Thompson – 00:13:10:

It’s the only one right now in the Atlanta area. The other one we had closed down. So besides that and the birth center right now is the only thing. One that has the water.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:13:19:

I know that’s one thing that’s changed here since 2020 when we last spoke on the podcast is there now is a freestanding birth center in Atlanta, which is an amazing development, but correct me if I’m wrong. There is no perfect hospital in the Metro Atlanta area, correct?

Tara Thompson – 00:13:33:

There is not. No. And actually as of-

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:13:37:

Not that there is such a thing as a perfect hospital, but you know what I mean? There’s no super ideal hospital.

Tara Thompson – 00:13:42:

And now there is actually another birth center that’s opening and they’re having their grand opening, I believe October 25th. They’re going to have a grand opening. So we will have another one, which is amazing.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:13:52:

Okay. So by the time this podcast comes out, there will be two freestanding birth centers, which I think is also can improve care in the hospitals. Cause then hospitals are like, Oh, we have to up our game if they’re providing this kind of individualized family-centered care. Maybe we can improve a little bit too.

Tara Thompson – 00:14:08:

Yes. And the main hospital that she mentioned, like the baby factory has changed since we last spoke Rebecca.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:14:16:

Okay.

Tara Thompson – 00:14:17:

Because I’ve been in there, you know, a few times with clients and it has changed over the years. And like you said, because the standard of care has changed with a lot of other places, I believe they’re up their game and was like, okay, well, we need to do something. Um, so they have changed some, but again, for-

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:14:33:

You are seeing some improvements in the area hospital.

Tara Thompson – 00:14:36:

Absolutely. And again, with the birth that Erica was looking for, um, that may not have been the best choice for her, you know, for our first choice.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:14:45:

Okay. Yeah. Cause it’s a little bit harder to get individualized care at such a large facility where they’re having so many births.

Tara Thompson – 00:14:52:

And I’m so glad she went with her gut because, because of how long her birth was, you know, it may have been different at that other hospital as well. You know, the hospital that she chose to give birth in was very patient, you know, so they let her do, you know, and choose on her own a lot of things where she was like, no, I don’t want this. And they were like, okay, well, we’re not going to do it. You know, so they gave her that choice. They gave her that option. I don’t think she would have had the same at that other hospital.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:15:18:

Okay. Erica, you went with your… your gut and your intuition. And I know your story has a lot of twists and turns. So let’s dive in. Tell us how…labor began. I know even that for your story was not straightforward. So talk about that.

Erica Wright – 00:15:38:

Yeah. I’m sad that this podcast is only an hour because this is probably like a five-hour story, but I’ll try to cliff notes. So yeah, after I switched practices and my husband and I took the water birth class because that’s kind of something that I wasn’t 100% set on it, but I wanted it to be an option. I wanted to have all the options available to me possible so I could choose in the moment. We did a lot of prep beforehand. I went to breastfeeding classes. I went to pelvic floor therapy, obviously the Childbirth Class. I mean, we were being as educated as possible as we possibly could that I would know and be able to advocate for myself. And I was my own informed, of informed consent. I was ensuring my own information. But shortly after I switched practices, they did the GBS test and I was GBS positive, which was kind of a downer because I knew that meant they were probably going to have to hook me to a hep lock, like on the IV for antibiotics. So again, I went right back to my Evidence Based Birth® booklet and the little one pager on the GBS information and the evidence on that. So decided that that was going to be, you know, a thing. But I told myself if this is the worst, you know, complication that I have in my pregnancy, like I’ll take it, you know, it’s fine. But that just kind of meant the policy, it’s either practice, the practice policy or the hospital said that means that you just need to be at the hospital about four hours before baby in order to get the antibiotics for them to kick in or whatever, or risk baby being taken to NICU at birth, which is something, of course, that I did not want. So that was kind of a kink in the works. 

But around 38 weeks, like you said, I’m a teacher and I was due early June. So I kept just saying I want to make it through the end of the school year, which I did, you know, plus some, but there wasn’t, that was like a blessing and a curse. It was great that I wasn’t working, but also like I didn’t have anything else to keep me distracted. I was just kind of waiting for a baby. So around 38 weeks, which was the end of the school year, I started doing all the natural induction methods. Like I said, I called on Tara to come and do a massage to help like get things going. Brittany, her teammate, the other doula was a prenatal chiropractor. She came and did an appointment for me too. I mean, we, the dates, the raspberry tea, I was doing all this stuff. And then at our 40 week appointment, she said like, you know, the, she kind of gave it to me straight up. The midwife said the latest you can go will be 41 and five. And kind of my whole pregnancy, I had, I mean, call it mother’s intuition, call it whatever you want. I kind of knew that I would be late one, because I wanted to go into spontaneous labor two, because my daughter was always measuring right on track. She was never big or anything. She was my first baby. I was late with my mom. I was like a week or two late even. So I kind of just like had a feeling that, so that was important to me that I was able to go into spontaneous labor and I had people that were going to support that decision. So she said like kind of 41 and five as a hard deadline. And that was at my 40 week appointment. So I was like, okay, like I can live with that. She said, but odds are you’ll have a baby this week. So I was like, great. Well, that didn’t happen. Again, I’m doing all this stuff. I’m hand expressing colostrum, which highly recommend to anyone who’s pregnant right now and save. I saved the little freezer vials of colostrum and brought that to the hospital. But I’m doing everything that I possibly can. 

So my 41-week appointment rolls around and they did an ultrasound and found out that my amniotic fluid was a little bit low. So it wasn’t on like the low, dangerously low end, but kind of like low end of normal, which can happen like late in pregnancy. They told me she did a cervical check. I was like one centimeter. I did ask for a cervical check at that point because I kind of just wanted the information. She said I was at negative two station, one centimeter, but 70% effaced, probably because all the dates and the raspberry tea I was consuming. But she couldn’t, and I asked about a membrane sweep, not to do one, but just to like see what she thought. And she said that she couldn’t do one at that point, even if she wanted to. So that we scheduled a non-stress test for like that was on a Monday. We scheduled a non-stress test for the fall, the coming up Thursday. So in a couple of days. And then the next, so the next day was a Tuesday. I went on like a really hot walk with one of my friends who came over and walked to like a coffee place nearby. I live in a very hilly neighborhood. So it was, you know, June, very hilly, super hot, long walk, kind of on purpose. And when I got back, I lost my mucus plug. Kind of after that, I started to feel just super, super light leaking and like a little bit crampy. But I was kind of like, no, I don’t think. I mean, it was super, super light. It wasn’t like I was having to like change my underwear frequently or anything. 

But then Tuesday night around 2 a.m, so I guess Wednesday, super early morning around 2 a.m. Is when I started to feel some contractions that were definitely like, oh, this is like not just a little crampy. This is like, I’m definitely feeling this. And they had a pattern. They were getting like a little bit stronger, a little bit closer together kind of throughout the night. I woke up my husband maybe around 5 a.m. So I did like a few hours of that. I remember calling the nurse to kind of explain. And I also said, you know, but I have kind of been feeling leaking since this afternoon. And I explained it to her. And she was like, no, like what it felt like. And she said, no, that doesn’t sound like your water has ruptured. But it sounds like we’re going to have a baby today, basically. And that was Wednesday at like 6 a.m. Well, again, we did not have, spoiler… We did not have a baby that day because she was like, you know, rest. My whole plan was to stay at home as long as possible, except for like trying to go in with enough time to get the antibiotics because of the GBS. But after like a two hour nap, I woke up and the contractions went away. So because of all the knowledge and like the research and stuff that I’ve read, I kind of knew that that meant it was prodromal labor. And throughout the day, I didn’t really have many more contractions. So that just kind of impeded my sleep. I wasn’t really able to get any sleep between Tuesday and Wednesday, really. So then Wednesday, Wednesday to Thursday night, tried to go to sleep again. And I may have fallen asleep for an hour or so. And then right at midnight, contractions started again. So it’s now Thursday, you know, super early morning, right at midnight. And that was like, okay, this is for real this time. So that was so now I’m at 41 weeks and three days. So I labored at home as long as possible, like I wanted to. I kind of knew that that was real. I walked laps around my house, the yoga ball. I remember being on the couch. I remember throwing up a lot.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:22:35:

And did you have Tara there at that point yet or not?

Erica Wright – 00:22:39:

No, just my husband and I. He was doing a lot of comfort measures that we had practiced. Tara and Brittany came over for like a birth rehearsal. That’s kind of the end of the EBB class or like as when you get closer to your birth, you do a birth rehearsal. So it was kind of like we were redoing the birth rehearsal, except this time it wasn’t the rehearsal. We were just in our house for real. So that was super, super helpful. But yeah, I remember throwing up a lot, not really wanting to eat anything at all. That was all kind of a blur. I was like very much in the zone. I know Garrett was texting back and forth with Tara and Brittany. They had a group text just like updating them on my progress. And then when my contractions were like three to four minutes apart for like two hours is when we made the decision to go ahead into the hospital around 7 a.m. I think we got there around 7:30 in the morning on Thursday morning.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:23:30:

Okay, and so you had kind of labored all night. Like that. Okay. And then got to the hospital thinking, oh, we’re probably pretty far along because how close the contractions are. And Tara, did you meet them there then?

Tara Thompson – 00:23:44:

No, I wasn’t the first doula on. Brittany was the first doula on.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:23:48:

Okay, so Brittany met them there. And what did you find out when you got there about how far along you were?

Erica Wright – 00:23:54:

So as soon as I got there, it was kind of, I would like the fear, pain, stress, like cycle. I was already like kind of getting out of my body and more into my head because of just being in a different setting. And like we had, because we switched practices so late, we didn’t get to schedule like a hospital tour. So I had truly never been there. I’d never been in the building, didn’t really know what the rooms look like. So just a new setting. And then the nurse that was, we like bypass triage. They got us into a room right away, which was great. But the nurse that was there, that was our nurse kind of said some like abrasive things kind of right off the bat before like even look, of course, I came with my birth plan, came with everything before even looking at like my birth preferences or anything was like, okay, like that’s fine and all, but you’re at a hospital now. There are rules here. I remember that very specific. Like the whole thing is kind of a blur, but there are snapshots.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:24:50:

Talking to you like you’re a child or something.

Erica Wright – 00:24:52:

Yeah. There are snapshots that are very vivid. And I remember that pretty vividly. So that was kind of like a, wait, and then.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:24:59:

Oh, that would definitely, I can see that creating fear, a fear response. Yeah.

Erica Wright – 00:25:04:

So there was that. And then I think when they first put the monitor on my daughter, there was like a little fluctuation or something in her heart rate or something that made them want to put me on IV fluids. And I’m like, hold on. That’s not like, has anyone read my birth plan? Can someone just like that is not it. And I didn’t know. Also, what kind of was working against me, my the practice that I had switched to was only on call Mondays, Wednesdays and Fridays and every other weekend. And so, of course, I went in on a Thursday. So it’s the practice that they share call with. So I did not know this midwife. That was kind of like another. It was just all very foreign. And I think that took me back a little bit and just got me in my head. So my contractions really, really slowed down. So then they were like eight to 10 minutes apart. And she had me like lay down and be on my side, which was excruciating. And for whatever reason, really slowed my contractions down to like do the heart rate monitor to put on the monitor or something. That was like the first introduction to like being in the hospital room. So already kind of having to fight a little bit for that. 

Contractions slowed way down. And then the midwife came in to check me and told me I was only three centimeters. So that was like really disheartening, pretty deflating. Like we have a long road ahead kind of realizing that this is going to be a while. So because of that and kind of telling her about the leaking that I was feeling, I said, I’ve kind of been feeling leaking since like Tuesday afternoon. The nurse was kind of like, what did you say? Okay, well, let’s go ahead and do like an amniotic fluid test. And I’m like, okay. And that came back positive. So because of that, they kind of backdated me to like Tuesday afternoon. And this is now Thursday morning. And so they wanted to start Pitocin because of this and being GBS positive. So that was kind of the second battle, second or third battle at this point, which, of course, is something I did not want. I remember my husband, this is before Brittany got there also. So my husband kind of had to be an advocate also and saying like, well, we know that we don’t know when her water was ruptured. We just know that it’s ruptured now. And I remember him like kind of having a little chat with the nurse, like, we don’t know for sure. So like, we just didn’t want to be put on a clock. And that very much was putting us on a clock.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:27:37:

Tara, from the doula’s perspective, you know, when things like this happening with. PROM as we call it in the birth world, premature rupture membranes and GBS and Prodromal labor and prolonged rupture of membranes. Like what are some thoughts that come into your head as the doula in terms of like, especially for someone like Erica who had a specific birth plan?

Tara Thompson – 00:28:00:

For one, I was very thankful that she did switch, you know, even everything that she went through. And like you said, unfortunately, in the hospital, it’s we’re in the hospital, you know, so we can’t it won’t be the perfect birth. But they did. It wasn’t as abrupt because if she had gone into the previous hospital that she was at and said her waters have been broken since Tuesday, they are normally like 24 hours, you know, so it would have been.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:28:27:

They would have been like you need to have a C-section.

Tara Thompson – 00:28:28:

Exactly.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:28:29:

Yeah.

Tara Thompson – 00:28:30:

And for where she was, you know, being at three centimeters and GBS positive and her waters broken for so long. Yeah, that would have definitely turned into a Cesarean. So again, I was thankful that she was in that place. And unfortunately, you know, with the nurses, it is sometimes the best place that we have. And then sometimes it depends on the staff that’s there, you know, unfortunately.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:28:56:

Right. You can’t always control who walks into your room and the impact they can have on your birth. On the other hand, you can have a completely different experience where you have somebody come in who’s very warm and makes you feel safe.

Tara Thompson – 00:29:07:

Yes.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:29:08:

And that can completely change the tone of the room.

Tara Thompson – 00:29:10:

And normally like, with us as doulas, we don’t go in, you know, unless we had joined them at the home and different things like that, we normally don’t go in with them because like she said, at that hospital, they go into triage first.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:29:22:

And you’re not allowed in there?

Tara Thompson – 00:29:24:

Sometimes we are, again, depending on. The staff and you know, what’s going on. I have been in triage a lot at that place. So most of the times we are, um, but. Just because to see where she was and, you know, her waters hadn’t been broken. And if it was earlier, then they could send her home. So, you know, we go in and we let them go in first just to see where they are. And then we join them after.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:29:48:

So Erica, they were offering Pitocin or were strongly recommending it. What did you end up deciding to do with that?

Erica Wright – 00:29:55:

So my husband, again, was kind of an advocate for low dose, like going through the EBB class. He like knew things to to ask for and ask for low dose if at all possible. So I don’t know the the numbers are I remember the number like eight or 10 or 12 is in my mind. So I think around then whatever milliliters or units or however much it was. So we did do low dose Pitocin at the beginning. Again, that was like really strongly recommended. I remember being in like excruciating pain on the Pitocin contractions. They just kind of never left. I never got like the down like coming out of it. They just kind of stayed coming. And even when I was able to get a little bit of a relief, it wasn’t very much and it was pretty short lived. I remember not really having freedom of movement, which was another thing that was on my birth preferences that was really important to me because the nurse kept coming in and wanting to do the monitoring. And I think I wrote down like 20 minutes for every hour, but I feel like it was much more frequent than that. We did ask for wireless monitors. Again, going through the class, we knew that was something we could ask for. The nurse told me, oh, those those barely work. You don’t want that. You don’t want that. So we were like, okay-

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:31:17:

Is this the same nurse that checked you in or a different nurse?

Erica Wright – 00:31:20:

This is the same one, yes.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:31:21:

Okay. So, kind of a little bit of a negative tone in her treatment. Okay.

Erica Wright – 00:31:27:

Yeah. Yeah, you don’t want that. Those barely work. You’re not going to like that. So I kept having to get in the bed, which is incredibly uncomfortable. And she couldn’t quite get my daughter’s heart rate. So she kept messing with it and scooting. And I just remember being like, come on. Maybe it’s mother’s intuition, but I wanted to be like, listen, she’s fine. I know she’s fine, which is probably not good advice, just going off your feelings. But I just knew like her heart rate is fine. And it was it was strong throughout my entire labor had her heart rate dipped or fluctuated or, you know, a decel or whatever. I definitely like we are really lucky. She was strong the entire time. So was on Pitocin for a while. I don’t remember. I want to say we got off it around the afternoon’ish. So Brittany is there at this point. Of course, I’ve had the antibiotics, which I also didn’t know that I thought it was like you get the antibiotics like once. And just as long as it’s four hours before baby, then like you’re good. Didn’t know that it was every four hours. So kept having to get strapped up to the IV to get more the more antibiotics every four hours. And I’ve I feel like I probably got like 20 doses of antibiotics by the end because it was so frequent. So around Thursday afternoon, the same midwife that checked me in, that was not my midwife, wasn’t familiar with her, who she also brought with her like a shadow, someone was like shadowing her or something. And again, that was another one of those things that I was like, has anyone read my birth plan? And I said, no, students know this know that I wanted as few people in the room as possible. And it’s like, I mean, so that was frustrating, too. 

But they were both kind of going back and forth. They’re like, tag teaming almost like the, the battle of the Pitocin versus not versus whatever it was, the IV fluids, kind of all that, that we had to argue against. But she checked me and I was six to seven centimeters. So like in active labor. And then she did agree to take me off Pitocin entirely. And so that was like, thing like, I felt like things are going my way a little bit took me off, it was an immediate relief. The idea was that I’m in active labor now. So my body would just kind of pick up and keep going. Also, what worked in our favor a few hours later, it was the nurse’s shift change around 7pm. So the nurse that had checked us in was gone. And the night nurse came and she was amazing. I was like, finally, my labor is going my way. I’m off Pitocin. I have my freedom of movement. We asked her for the wireless monitor. She brought it right away. She sandpapered my belly and stuck it to there. Guess what? It worked perfectly. We were like, okay, like I finally, it was like, I have freedom of movement. I remember having to go to the bathroom a lot. So that was nice to just be able to go and be on my ball. And it was finally going my way. But at this point, I mean, I was still vomiting a lot. I had nothing in my system, I’m sure. I could not. Having freedom to eat and drink as I pleased was also important to me.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:34:40:

But you couldn’t really use it.

Erica Wright – 00:34:42:

Anything. Exactly. Didn’t want to eat anything. Was still throwing up a lot.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:34:47:

Were you getting a bit dehydrated at this point, do you think? Because you had declined the IV fluids? Or were they running IV fluids?

Erica Wright – 00:34:54:

I don’t know. Because eventually, when I was on the epidural and got the catheter, I remember my midwife telling my husband like, wow, she was really hydrated. Good job. Good job, dad.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:35:07:

Okay.

Erica Wright – 00:35:07:

Well, that’s good. I guess that was like being out a lot. And I remember having to go to the bathroom a lot, which the toilet contractions were-

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:35:13:

Okay. So you were staying hydrated. Okay.

Erica Wright – 00:35:16:

Yeah. My husband said I kept like biting on the metal straw. He was afraid I was going to like chip my tooth because I was like, I was like, really? I don’t remember drinking from a straw at all. Yeah. All very much a blur. But also at this point, so I had nothing in my system, but I had been awake for like 72 hours at this point. So with being off Pitocin, they just like really slowed down. I think at this point, it was like 2 or 3 a.m. And that’s when shift changed with Brittany and Tara. So Tara came and did the whole night shift. And my husband even said recently, he was like, Tara was working so hard, like relaxation techniques for me. The plan, she kind of told me the plan. Was just to like rest and reset, like not try to work super hard and force it, but just rest enough to be able to come back and kind of conserve my energy a little bit. I think my contractions at that point were like 10 to 15 minutes apart. So they really slowed down. I remember, again, I remember just being exhausted on the yoga ball at some point. And I guess I was like dozing off. I remember Tara catching my shoulders like many times from like tipping off the yoga ball, just like nodding off. I got in the shower at some point, the night nurse taped up my wireless monitor and like plastic to keep it from getting wet and let me just kind of sit in the shower, which, oh, I think I forgot to mention this. The whole, the water birth thing went away as soon as my amniotic fluid was positive. But the tub that they use for the water birth, that’s like an inflated tub, stayed in the room the entire time, like mocking me. Like you could be having a water birth right now. 

Here I am, the tub waiting for you. But you, yeah, never, that was off the table, like pretty early on, but kept looking at the tub in the corner. But she let me kind of just sit in the shower and the water like wash over me. Of course, the wireless monitor did get wet somehow and she had to pull it off and then sandpaper my skin in like the same spot to stick it back on. I remember that being painful, like in postpartum, just like having to put cream on it all the time in the moment. It was like the least of my concerns. Like I could care less about that. But Tara, so all night long, Tara was whispering like affirmations to me. I remember her saying at one point, like, you don’t see like your body is doing it. Your body is doing it. You don’t need that stuff. Your body is doing a great job. She let my husband sleep for a couple of hours, which was like great because when he woke up, he was like ready to get back at it. So this is now like Friday morning. So I’m 41 weeks and four days. And since it’s the more, so I think midwives do the 24 hour shifts and nurses do the 12 hour shifts. So at this point, my midwife, so it’s Friday now and my midwife was back on call. So it was actually the same midwife that I had just met with at my 41 week appointment that had like checked me at 41 weeks and talked to me a little bit about like scheduling the non-stress test and stuff like that. So I, at least I’m like seeing a familiar face and I’m like, I know, you know, my preferences and you know, like how this is going. So she came in and it was just an immediate, like kind of relief that she was there and knew, knew me at least. I felt like she’s like on my team. But because of that, she, because my contractions had like really slowed down. I asked her to check me again and she said, I was like seven and a half centimeters. So I had basically not progressed in like over 12 hours, which again was like really devastating.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:38:53:

Tara, were you there in the room then at that point?

Tara Thompson – 00:38:55:

Yes.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:38:56:

What was that night and that morning like from your perspective?

Tara Thompson – 00:39:00:

Well, she definitely, like she said, she was working all night long. She hadn’t slept. So I was so proud of her because of her. She was exhausted, but she was still going. She was still pushing. She was like, no, I’m going to do this. So I love that she had that in her. Great. And that’s what helped her.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:39:20:

Yeah.

Tara Thompson – 00:39:20:

You know, even like with the shower and I can’t remember holding these combs. Like she wasn’t letting these combs go.

Erica Wright – 00:39:26:

Oh, yeah.

Tara Thompson – 00:39:28:

Unless she went to the bathroom, they were on the sink and then she would pick them back up and hold them again. So she was-

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:39:33:

Holding the combs in your hand was the comfort measures that really helped.

Tara Thompson – 00:39:38:

Yes.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:39:38:

Okay.

Tara Thompson – 00:39:38:

Yes. And I remember one point where she was like, I’ll just have two almonds. I’m like, okay. And that was like all she ate like the whole time, you know, but again, her husband was there. He was very supportive, but also he was exhausted. So I was glad that I was there and, you know, and fresh and was able to let him sleep so that he couldn’t be there, you know, and then just going through that, but also letting her know, you know, she, as far as dilation, it was only maybe a half a centimeter, but other things were going on, you know? So definitely her body was still working. Of course, not as quickly as we would hope that it would be.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:40:14:

A baby was moving down.

Tara Thompson – 00:40:15:

Yes, exactly. So other, I can’t remember exactly what happened, but there was other things happening, you know, as far as either effacement or the station had changed. So it wasn’t just the dilation, you know, that we needed to focus on. So, yeah.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:40:29:

So, kind of help give some perspective when it seems like all doom and gloom. So what did you decide to do next, Erica?

Erica Wright – 00:40:37:

So again, hearing that not much dilation had happened was like really heartbreaking. And just knowing like the end, like has like I knew they were going to like say, you know, time is up basically. So my midwife, I remember this again, like there are snapshots that are pretty vivid. I remember her telling me, I want you to imagine yourself beating your head against a wall. I want you to picture it. She said that is what you’re doing right now. She said, your body is so exhausted, it can’t respond to the work that you’re doing. You are doing all of this work and your body is just too exhausted to respond. I did the math. I think I was awake for like 82, 83 hours at this point with like maybe one or two hour naps like in between there, but many days ago. So her telling me that was really like, okay. And she also like shared her own birth story with me. She said, I’m a midwife. I practiced at this hospital and my first baby ended up in a C-section and it was not what I wanted. 

And, you know, sometimes these, these things go this way and kind of, she kind of just like really leveled with me and it was kind of like a hard chat. I knew she also said like, your, your best chance at a vaginal birth right now is like you, you can’t keep going. I was dangerously close to being diagnosed failure to progress. And I knew that meant a C-section, which again, I kind of prioritizing my birth plan and my birth preferences of vaginal, you know, healthy mom, healthy baby, vaginal birth was kind of next on that priority list. So she said, your best chance at a vaginal birth is an epidural so that you can rest. And while you’re resting to be on Pitocin to progress and to speed this up. And my husband even said recently he was in agreement with that because he had shared that like, just watching me in agony was like getting really hard for him to like even watch just knowing how exhausted I was. And he, you know, agreed with the midwife. And then, of course, I’m looking at to Tara because I trust Tara more than anyone else in that room. And I remember afterward thinking if Tara had said, no, Erica, like I think we can keep going a little bit longer. I think you are making progress. I think if she had said let’s not do that just yet, like let’s wait. I think you can – my husband was like I was going to have to bring Tara in the hallway to have a conversation because like this is getting –

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:43:23:

But thankfully it sounds like Tara and your husband were on the same page probably right at that point.

Erica Wright – 00:43:28:

If Tara had told me I think you can – I think you can go a little bit longer, I would have been like okay, absolutely.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:43:34:

And we talk in the EBB Childbirth Class about the difference between pain and suffering.

Tara Thompson – 00:43:38:

Exactly.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:43:39:

It sounds like – Yeah.

Tara Thompson – 00:43:39:

And at that point, like she said, you know, her body was just – she was just mentally she was going, but her body physically was not going.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:43:48:

I think sometimes I have seen that in myself and friends and family that you think you can power your way through something mentally, but your body tells you a different story, right? And you have to listen to your body as well.

Tara Thompson – 00:44:00:

Exactly. She needed the rest because like she said, over 83 hours, you know, of her just going.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:44:05:

Yeah.

Erica Wright – 00:44:05:

Yeah. So Tara agreed. Tara was like time to call it basically. And I just – that was when I sobbed. Like I hadn’t cried this entire time, I don’t think. And that was when I just like – it just felt like I was like succumbing to failure or like defeat and like giving up even though I knew like it’s the birth preferences. Erica, it’s not a birth plan.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:44:29:

It’s not a failure.

Erica Wright – 00:44:29:

Stay flexible. Stay flexible. And, you know, things don’t always go according to plan. Baby does what baby – you know. And I knew that like but not really like deep down. I was like, yeah, but I can – I really was like –

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:44:42:

You hadn’t let those feelings out yet.

Erica Wright – 00:44:44:

But I can will – I thought I could will my plan into existence because I’m going to be so educated and I’m going to be so prepared and I will – and I have a strong will and I’m mentally tough and I can just will it into happening. And that was just kind of like – it felt like defeat. And of course I know it wasn’t because of how much work I did and everything that we had learned up until then allowed us to make the decisions that we were able to make to advocate for ourselves. And I remember Tara saying at our postpartum checkup appointment with her and Brittany that Tara was like, you saved yourself from major surgery. Like in all of this and switching practices and advocating for, you know, this, that, and the other. I was able to have a vaginal birth and a healthy baby.

Tara Thompson – 00:45:30:

Yeah. Because like she said, you know, from the beginning, like I mentioned, from two days, her water being broken and them not doing anything. Definitely if she would have gone, there’s no way they would have let her go for 83 hours, you know, without – Yeah, that would have definitely –

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:45:44:

But all of this, you had no signs of infection. Baby’s heart rate was doing well. Everything. And that’s – There was no indication for an urgent Cesarean or anything.

Tara Thompson – 00:45:53:

Yeah. And that’s the thing about that.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:45:54:

Yeah. Just the timeline.

Erica Wright – 00:45:55:

Yeah.

Tara Thompson – 00:45:56:

With that hospital, you know, like I said, they’re a little more laid back and watching mom and baby to making sure everybody’s okay. And then that’s when they decide some things.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:46:06:

Okay. So Erica, tell us about the experience of getting the epidural.

Erica Wright – 00:46:11:

Um, so that wasn’t great either. I think they had contracted out, um, like anesthesiologists. I think she wasn’t like at the, um, like employed by that hospital or anything. I think she was. Went to many places. And I think she mostly works at the baby factory hospital, but she came in. And again, I have like snapshots of very vivid things. She came in and was like, you know, how’s it going? And she basically pushed over. She’s like, this is a sterile environment. I remember her getting kind of sassy with the nurse. Like, this is a sterile environment. Don’t you need to be over there type of thing? Like just very, which was fine. That didn’t bother me. But then she was like, so how are you doing? And I was like, or like, I think she expected me to be like, hi, I’m so glad you’re here. And like, I just wasn’t. And so I was like, oh, I’m, I’m not good. Like, no, I’m, I’m not ready for, for this. Basically. I said like, no. And she was like, oh, why? And asked me why. And I said, I remember saying specifically, I, I never wanted to medicalize my birth is what I told her like end of sentence. And she goes. Well you know, I specifically remember her saying, with our sedentary lifestyles nowadays, our bodies are just not built for birth like they used to be. And I like, I think I looked at my husband. I don’t think I responded in the moment at all just because I was so exhausted. And I was like, this is going to be over soon. Like, I’m going to let’s just get. And he just kind of shook his head, I think. Like, let’s just go through. He was like, lady, do your job and get out of this room type of thing. He didn’t say that, but that was kind of the look on his face. Um, which I am, the more I think about like, as when I look back on that conversation, it makes me more mad now. But in the moment I was like, just too tired to even like defend myself really, or say anything. I just was like, okay, I’m just going to close my eyes, get this over with type of thing.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:48:18:

Mm-hmm.

Erica Wright – 00:48:19:

After the epidural, I fell asleep, I think, for about three hours, was able to get some sleep, and then woke up. I think my husband was still sleeping. I let him sleep for a little bit longer, started to feel pressure. I kind of wanted to wait until I felt constant pressure before pushing because I really didn’t – I knew I didn’t have the energy to push for like hours and hours. I wanted to kind of wait until I felt that constant pressure instead of just pressure during contractions. But he was kind of like, we need to – something kind of needs to happen because he kind of knew that the staff was still looking at the clock type of thing. So around 5-ish or maybe 6 p.m., my midwife came back and was like, let’s like practice push type of thing. Let’s just like see. And she checked me and she goes, oh, I can see – I can see your baby’s head. Like, do you want to feel it? And I was like – it was like, oh my gosh, like something’s happening. We’re making physical progress here a little bit. She asked me if I wanted to feel her head, which I did. It did not feel like a baby’s head. It felt like a water balloon, which is like the craziest thing. But she said her head was like twisting back and forth. Like she could see her head kind of moving. Like she was trying to root her way out. She was like, okay, I’m ready. Ready to come out now. My husband held one leg. At that point, Tara had already been there 12 hours. So they went through like three shift changes. And I think the whole thing ended up being like 43 hours of labor. But Brittany did her 12. Tara did her 12. And at this point, Brittany is now back. So she got to see birth. So Brittany was on my other leg, which I didn’t really want to push and deliver in the supine position on my back, which I was like kind of sidelined, but not really. But again, with the epidural and just being numb, I didn’t – it was just most – I guess just felt most natural at that point instead of re-situating. And we were kind of just going to practice and see anyways. But then because it was like, oh, baby’s head is right here. Time to like actually push. We kind of just went with that. So pushed for like 30 minutes, maybe. It didn’t feel that long to me, surprisingly. But then one push, or at some point her head came out. One push later, the rest of her came out. And she went to my chest. And meconium was everywhere.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:50:54:

And what did that feel like to be, like kind of done with the labor and pushing and have your baby on your chest?

Erica Wright – 00:51:01:

After all that, I remember just I was crying again at this point. And I remember just saying, my baby, my baby. It was like euphoric. I mean, scientists need to study that feeling and like bottle it somehow. That was just like she was like finally here. It just felt so good to have her in my arms and on my chest after all that.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:51:24:

You said there was meconium. Did she have to go to the NICU or anything like that?

Erica Wright – 00:51:29:

No, surprisingly. I remember a nurse, I guess it was a NICU nurse, like rubbing her a lot, which again, I didn’t really notice. I’m in like a whole other world. But my husband was, we wanted her to like not have a bath and not have her vernix like washed off. And he was like, she was rubbing it off because, but I guess she was trying to agitate her because of that. The concern with like her lungs, if she had aspirated any of that meconium, she didn’t end up, I think they let me have like gold, they let me have golden hours. She didn’t go to, they have like a little side room, which is still like in the main room with me, but like just over on the other wall. I remember her going over there for like some evaluation or like the weight and the length and stuff. But I think she was over there for like a lung evaluation too. I think the pediatrician came in, evaluated her lungs and it was kind of like, she seems fine, but like, let’s continue to monitor. Like she may, it was definitely a question. Like she may have to go to the NICU.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:52:34:

But she got to stay in the room with you, in the room.

Erica Wright – 00:52:36:

Yeah. So she never, yeah, she never went to the NICU. Yeah. She stayed with me. Cleaning up all the meconium was not fun. But again, that was the least of my concern. I remember I had like a very big placenta. I remember my midwife holding it up and showing me and she was like, this is the size of the wound inside you right now. Like, you know, healing, you need to take it easy. I had wanted to cut the cord because I’m, you know, it’s my placenta. I made it. I, she’s my baby. I want to be able to cut the cord. But when she was on my chest, there’s actually a picture. Brittany took a picture. I’m looking at her hands because her hands look exactly like my hands. And Garrett’s cutting the cord. My husband is cutting the cord because like I could care less about the cord. My baby’s hands look like my hands. Like that is all I was concerned about. It’s very sweet. So we at some point, I don’t remember how much later, but at some point went to the postpartum room, which of all the issues we had with like the staff and the hospital and the battles we kind of had to fight early on did not exist in the postpartum room. That was like a vacation. It felt very much like we were in a nice hotel type of thing. It was, it was lovely.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:53:55:

Tara. As the doula, I know you weren’t there at the moment of birth, but whenever you have a client who has a really long labor like that, I mean, I know it’s exhausting for the whole team, but what are some of your concerns with postpartum recovery after a really long labor with lots of interventions?

Tara Thompson – 00:54:12:

For one, like, again, with the baby, making sure that the baby was immediate, you know, skin to skin. So I was so glad, again, because her waters have been broken for so long or they thought it was, you know, we never know exactly even when her waters broke. But because the waters have broken so long, her labor was so long, you know, and the other things that was added in there. And she had like so many doses of antibiotics because, again, with me being there 12 hours, that was, you know, so many doses right there during that time. Right. So with that, again, a concern was a separation. So I was so thankful that the baby was never, you know, separated from them. Like she said, like the warming unit, everything is in the room and the labor and delivery. So they can do all of that there, you know, and them having somebody come in. And I’m sure there was extra from the team for pediatric just because of the meconium and everything. But the baby didn’t have to be taken away from them, you know, separated.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:55:07:

Yeah. They didn’t automatically take the baby just because there was GBS and prom.

Tara Thompson – 00:55:12:

Where, again, I can’t repeat enough. If she was at that other hospital, it would have definitely been a separation.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:55:18:

Like an automatic separation.

Tara Thompson – 00:55:21:

Automatic. Yeah.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:55:21:

Okay.

Tara Thompson – 00:55:21:

Between everything. Yeah. Yes.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:55:24:

Interesting. To have that perspective, of like, it felt like things didn’t necessarily go right, but they were still better than what, they could have been by a long shot.

Tara Thompson – 00:55:34:

Absolutely.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:55:36:

Yeah. Erica, you mentioned when you wrote in to tell us your story that you had difficulty with breastfeeding. Could you kind of talk just briefly about that?

Erica Wright – 00:55:45:

Yeah. I went to a breastfeeding 101 class, which is like a group class while pregnant, did a one-on-one consultation. Breastfeeding was very important to me. So felt as prepared as I could be, had the pump, had all the things. And then in the hospital, I remember having to seek out the lactation consultant to come and just check her latch. We in her first like two weeks of life, we went to the lactation consultants, Breastfeed Atlanta, which is super nearby to us. I think we went like five, four or five times before she hit two weeks old just because. And again, never really figured out exactly what she didn’t have any ties, no lip, no tongue, nothing. Everyone, you know, everyone and their mother had evaluated that she had no ties. Everyone’s sticking their finger in her mouth, but her latch just still wasn’t good. It was creasing my nipple every time she wasn’t wasn’t getting enough because of that. So her latch wasn’t super effective. I think her mouth was just like really small. They said she might just have a weak tongue. The tongue wasn’t able to suck as much. I mean, even that I’m she’s almost 16 months old and I’m still breastfeeding. Her latch still isn’t isn’t great, but it was incredibly painful. I had bloody nipples. I had pumped bloody milk, you know, when she was like two or three months old. It was just lots of had mastitis three times, lots of trials and tribulations there. And again, that was kind of one of those things where I feel like I’m pretty mentally tough. And I was like, well, my my birth didn’t go like I wanted it to. So, you know, my I’m going to breast that’s one thing I’m not going to compromise. I, again, was going to like will that into existence. So I sought out all the support that I possibly could to to make sure that that journey went the way I wanted it to. And it did. We’re still we’re still still going.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:57:48:

And what about your physical recovery? Because you went so many hours without sleep. Like, were you able to eventually catch up on sleep in the hospital or at home?

Erica Wright – 00:57:57:

A little bit. So again, yeah, that was really important to me too, because I had hand expressed colostrum in the vials that I had frozen. I had someone bring them to the hospital to us. And so I wanted to be able to get a longer stretch of sleep because I had gone so long without and just in general. So my husband was able to take over like one of the night feedings kind of early on with the little colostrum vials. And again, one of the main struggles too early on was it took a while for my milk to come in because I was so sleep deprived. I was super hydrated, but pretty sleep deprived. So my milk, it was still kind of colostrum for a while, which wasn’t really sustaining her. So that was really hard in the first couple of weeks. But eventually when I came in and was up to what she needed, then that got better. But yeah, my husband was able to give her like he took over like one night feeding early on. So we were able to do a bottle so that I was able to sleep through that feeding.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:58:56:

And that kind of takes us full circle back to the end of your pregnancy. And you’re talking about pumping the colostrum and how glad you were to do that.

Erica Wright – 00:59:05:

Yeah.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:59:05:

I didn’t realize it would be such like a lifesaver for you postpartum.

Erica Wright – 00:59:09:

It definitely was. Yeah. Yeah.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 00:59:11:

Yeah. Tara, any words of advice for people listening who are either supporting someone through a very long labor or who might go through one themselves?

Tara Thompson – 00:59:25:

For one, definitely like Erica mentioned, you know, listening to themselves for one. And there’s thinking about how it’s not having a plan, but the preferences. And, you know, because we can’t plan everything, we never know how it’s going to go. So even though we want it to go our way and do everything, sometimes we have to make a change. But just because we make a change doesn’t mean it’s the end of the world or does it mean, you know, that it’s horrible or I failed, or anything like that. Because again, we don’t have a crystal ball. We don’t see what’s going on inside. You know, we never know what’s happening. So just, doing everything that you can, being educated going forward, you know, so you can delay and let your body do whatever it needs to do. But again, going forward, if for some reason, something needs to be added, something needs to be taken away, something needs to change, then being open to that. But being educated and making sure that you’re informed and you have a say in what’s happening, you know, and everything that everybody, you know, knows what’s going on and they explained everything to you as well, you know, and just, you know, going back to the brain or the brand acronym, you know, asking all the benefits, the risks, you know, the alternatives, anything else we can do, you know, and using your gut. Like Erica said, you know, a lot of time it was her gut intuition that got her through. So definitely using that and then just saying, you know, can I get in a little more time? Do we have to do this right now? So those are really important, you know, and things that we share in EBB.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 01:00:58:

Yeah, those are all amazing strategies. And Erica, I keep thinking about the moment in your birth story when you said you just cried and released all those emotions related to not getting the birth that you wanted and how important it is to let those emotions out of you and to not bottle them up. And I was reading a few years ago about how when we cry, our tears actually can like are releasing different chemicals and things that it is actually not just a spiritual and emotional release, but a physical release that can then let you move forward, right? So thank you for being honest and vulnerable and sharing your story. Are there any words of advice you have for anyone going through something similar?

Erica Wright – 01:01:43:

Um, I tell everyone that asks for advice that’s pregnant, first and foremost, hire a doula or even better doulas if you can. That’s number one. I guess number two, like just be as educated as possible. Consume accurate and, you know, information that you can take a Childbirth Class, take a breastfeeding class if you’re interested in breastfeeding. Take just be your own again, your own advocate and your own part of informed consent. You are the informed part of that. And when you take that into your own like knowledge is power. So being as educated as possible. Um, again, like Tara said, exactly birth preferences, not birth plan and being flexible, which wasn’t really in my vocabulary. I kind of said, yeah, of course, you know, we never can predict birth. Yeah, sure, sure, sure. But kind of-

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 01:02:37:

It’s like a visceral lesson in letting go of control, because I think parenting in general is a lesson, right? And learning to surrender. Yeah, the things that are out of your hands.

Erica Wright – 01:02:49:

You can only control what you can control. Yeah. So just knowing you having a plan A, B, C, D, E, and being okay with that. And I the whole time I was like, my body’s gonna do what my body was made to do. My body is gonna do what my body’s supposed to do. So um, and just being proud, proud of my body for doing everything that it did do. I guess the last piece of advice would also be if you’re interested in breastfeeding, support isn’t going to fall in your lap. Unfortunately, we live in a society where breastfeeding is very, um, not super supported, not at the forefront. So you have to seek your own support and breastfeeding if that is the journey you choose. So look for, look for people in your community, IBCLCs in your community, even at the hospital asking. I mean, I had to ask many times for the IBCLC in the hospital to come and visit. I mean, she’s very busy. Um, but just not giving up on, on that too. Making sure you have the support to continue that if you want to.

Tara Thompson – 01:03:48:

That’s another reason why I’ve, um, started to go on the IBCLC path, just because, you know, I want to be able to help my clients more, you know, like she said, that initial, that postpartum, you know, is, but so much I can do with the education that I got from doula training. You know, you don’t get, it’s, it’s a little bit of breastfeeding information, but it’s enough. So with me now that I’m a breastfeeding counselor, that’s more than enough now for me to help them initially until they can see an IBCLC. Because sometimes at some hospitals, you know, you don’t see the IBCLC until the next day, you know, or a couple of days later. So you definitely want to have that. And I teach prenatal, um, breastfeeding classes so they can go in a little more informed. So even before having the baby.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 01:04:34:

That’s amazing, Tara. I can’t wait to get the news that you’ve officially gotten your IBCLC designation. We all look forward to that. Thank you both so much for coming on the podcast and sharing this really, I think, unique, but also common story in terms of what it’s like to have a long birth where plans change. And we all learned a lot from listening to you both. So thank you so much.

Erica Wright – 01:04:56:

Thank you so much for having me.

Dr. Rebecca Dekker – 01:04:59:

This podcast episode was brought to you by the Evidence Based Birth® Childbirth Class. This is Rebecca speaking. When I walked into the hospital to have my first baby, I had no idea what I was getting myself into. Since then, I’ve met countless parents who felt that they too were unprepared for the birth process and navigating the healthcare system. The next time I had a baby, I learned that in order to have the most empowering birth possible, I needed to learn the evidence on childbirth practices. We are now offering the Evidence Based Birth® Childbirth Class totally online. In your class, you will work with an Instructor who will skillfully mentor you and your partner in evidence-based care, comfort measures, and advocacy so that you can both embrace your birth and parenting experiences with courage and confidence. Get empowered with an interactive online Childbirth Class you and your partner will love. Visit evidencebasedbirth.com/childbirthclass to find your class now.